User talk:Notmyhandle

Pokemon RS&E - Sprites
Hi NMH. Whilst i was going around adding PRS&E sprites into a category (Category:Pokémon Ruby and Sapphire images), i have found several files with incorrect names. As i am replacing the files currently, please could you delete these files to avoid any confusion?? Thanks, --Danneal12 (talk) 09:43, 14 April 2014 (UTC)


 * http://strategywiki.org/wiki/File:PRS%26E_Triathalete_Runner_M.png
 * http://strategywiki.org/wiki/File:PRS%26E_Triathalete_Runner_F.png
 * http://strategywiki.org/wiki/File:PRS%26E_Triathalete_Biker_M.png
 * http://strategywiki.org/wiki/File:PRS%26E_Triathalete_Biker_F.png
 * http://strategywiki.org/wiki/File:PRS%26E_Triathalete_Swimmer_M.png
 * http://strategywiki.org/wiki/File:PRS%26E_Triathalete_Swimmer_F.png

As i tried to upload new files, they identified that they were similar file names and so told me to add to each file instead. Therefore, could you just change the file names instead of deleting them - thanks!! --Danneal12 (talk) 09:43, 14 April 2014 (UTC)

Concerning Lego
If that's the way Wikipedia handles it, I will never object. I defer to Wikipedia whenever I am unsure myself. Interestingly, there's a discussion about that topic on the talk page for Lego, but their wp:Wikipedia:Manual_of_Style/Trademarks is consistent in that it recommends Time, Kiss, and Asus over TIME, KISS, and ASUS. As such, LEGO should be Lego. I guess if anyone ever objects to it on this site, we'll have to refer them to that page. Or officially adopt it into our own guide, and site them as the source for the decision.  Pro cyon  02:25, 15 April 2014 (UTC)
 * My view is that is Wikipedia's encyclopedia style and we can be more gamer/corporate specific. I feel we should match the actual game name as closely as possible (within technical limitations). -- Prod (talk) 04:30, 15 April 2014 (UTC)
 * Sticking with sentence case/Wikipedia is better IMO since we can justify our position with that rationale. Sticking with corporate typesetting also has its rationale though... both are arbitrary. Bleh. Also, maybe some day someone will code a bot to import all of the intros from Wikipedia and auto-stub all of the thousands of games we are missing. -- 05:33, 15 April 2014 (UTC)
 * The only problem with that rationale, is that you always see "Super Mario Bros." written in capital letters on the box, and on the title screen, but we don't name the guide "SUPER MARIO BROS." even though that would match the type setting. Admittedly, the Lego issue is a bit different, but ultimately if the proper redirects are in place, it should be somewhat arbitrary, as long as it's consistent across the entire site.   Pro  cyon  14:04, 15 April 2014 (UTC)
 * My preference would be we go by the trademarked name. Or the name they use when talking about the game (like in the manual or on the website). -- Prod (talk) 14:14, 15 April 2014 (UTC)
 * , the only downside to that is some games have multiple typeset spellings. Check out Picross e. I used sentence case here because the game is named "picross e" in the box art, and on its website it is "PICROSS e". Which would you choose? -- 15:26, 15 April 2014 (UTC)

My Activity
Sorry I haven't been active as much. I recently became promoted to bureaucrat/admin on Maple Wikia. I'll see if I can be more active.

Also, I'm guessing Prod hasn't recovered the quest data for me that was lost in that rollback yet. --PirateIzzy (talk) 05:53, 24 April 2014 (UTC)

In-line image overkill
Hey NMH. I'm getting really concerned about the frequency of the use of in-line images in the LOZ guide. For example, in The Legend of Zelda/Underworld/Quest 1/Dungeon 5, why does every instance of an item or monster name necessitate an in-line image? For one thing, the first instance of the word Dodongo doesn't even refer to an actual encounter with them. The second instance is the actual encounter, so why does the first instance need the image? Then there's all the Gibdos and Keys. The page has become so busy, that it's actually harder to read than it used to be. Images distract the eyes from text. In-line images should really be used sparingly, as a way to direct readers to point of particular interest. On that page, the Whistle is really the only absolutely necessary in-line image. Then maybe the Digdogger, map, compass, heart container, and triforce. Everything else is kind of surplus, and makes it look more like a "My first book" for little kids who can't fully read yet. Can we scale it back, even just a little?  Pro cyon  01:28, 8 May 2014 (UTC)


 * Yeah I was thinking about that threshold while I was making the edits. I think that initial references to the object makes sense, but if a section refers to the object multiple times, then those additional references don't need it. However, on Dungeon 5 there is no repetition. If a section is more clear then it should be revised. For example, I changed the unordered list to ordered. I added a small reference in step 3 that clarifies that the bomb is used to bypass the future dodongos. However, I need an expert to identify which step it bypasses them in. My vision of all completed guides is to have heavily referenced in-line images like these so that it reads like a madlib book. The thresholds to choose, to refine our aesthetics, are: image size (which determines clarity of the image and line spacing), frequency (how many in a given amount of space), and limits (are bosses out of the question?). The main benefit to these in-line image templates are not only visual guides - e.g. they can be read by scanning the images rather than having to read any text at all, but the cross-page linking that allows for quick reference to the appendices. Text-majority writings are only for technical details. -- 01:47, 8 May 2014 (UTC)
 * One interesting way we could organize guides for sections of games that have grid-based maps (where we have a map that can be used to reference specific rooms), is we could have table-based pages with a row for each room, or a header for each room. I'm thinking of columns like: |room (xy coordinates)|details|exits to|items found|enemies found. -- 01:50, 8 May 2014 (UTC)


 * I guess what I'm trying to argue for is "less is more". I think the way we handled A Link to the Past was really good.  For example, if a player visited The Legend of Zelda: A Link to the Past/Skull Woods and was only interested in figuring out where the Fire Rod is, they could visually scan the page until they found the Fire Rod, and read the surrounding text.  Images are used sparingly, so when they're used, they really stand out.  You're also right about the size of the images.  The enhanced version of the sprites were enlarged for visual appeal on the items page.  They make poor in-line image substitutes.  To do it correctly, unaltered and original sized (1:1) sprites should be used (like in A Link to the Past) instead of trying to shrink down enlarged images.  They would be 16 pixels high and fit within the text really well.  That would also be a lot less taxing on the server.   Pro  cyon  02:17, 8 May 2014 (UTC)


 * I can agree with both points. If you would be so kind to upload the originals, I will implement them. Please see my modifications to the in-line image guidelines, here. -- 05:46, 8 May 2014 (UTC)
 * I constrained the images to 16px height. Take another look at The Legend of Zelda/Underworld/Quest 1/Dungeon 5. The visual disruption to the text is much less now. Does your opinion still stand? I feel like the general rule of thumb should follow Wikipedia's rules for using links. That is, if the topic is re-mentioned in the same paragraph, don't re-link, but multiple links can occur on the page. I do not know what Wikipedia's guidelines for lists is, though. -- 05:56, 8 May 2014 (UTC)
 * IMO, it still feels a bit busy. In addition to A Link to the Past, I realized that Castlevania II hit the ratio of in-line images to text really well also.  That's what I wish LOZ was shooting for.  As far as uploading new images, there's two approaches we can take.  One would be to leave the enhanced images, and upload unscaled images just for in-line images.  The other would be to replace the enhanced images, and upscale them just for the items page.  Any preference?   Pro  cyon  00:14, 9 May 2014 (UTC)
 * My view is that images overall should be used sparingly. We use all copyrighted game images under fair use, meaning each copyrighted image is there for a reason.  If we're having in-line copyrighted images, they should be there to highlight something very specific. -- Prod (talk) 01:04, 9 May 2014 (UTC)


 * Enhanced images are not helpful imo. Sprite rippers, artists, and walkthrough people want sprites, not some alternate version. The style is cool, but should not be used to replace the original sprites people are used to seeing. I don't have a way to understand the threshold you guys want to implement. -- 01:43, 9 May 2014 (UTC)
 * OK, I'll work on replacing the item sprites. But the threshold should be very straightforward.  Items should only be in-lined whenever/wherever they are actually found.  Important items are definites, items found once in every dungeon are probablies (maps, compass, heart container, triforce), other common items are iffy in my book (keys, bombs, rupees).  Personally, I think a good guideline for Monsters is that they should only have an in-line image once per page.   Pro  cyon  03:13, 9 May 2014 (UTC)


 * I have modified the help page, and am implementing a more reserved approach. I think that if it is in a different section, that the "count" should be reset so that a new reference can be used. Also, a bit related, it looks like we are missing a Blue Gohma boss sprite, if you can dig one out for us that would be great. -- 17:45, 9 May 2014 (UTC)

Skin-dependent layouts
I had been wondering why you were revising the layouts of my Crystalis edits until I realized StrategyWiki has more than out layout skin. The problem is that we are working at cross-purposes because we use different skins. It appears to me you are editing with the Monobook or Vector skin in mind whereas I tend to use Dolphin. My layouts look good in Dolphin and Whale but not in Monobook, whereas your layouts are the other way around. Perhaps we can discuss if there's a layout style that can work well with most of the four skins. —WhosAsking (talk) 08:01, 14 May 2014 (UTC)


 * (putting this here so you get a notification): I edit with Monobook because 1) it will exist if Dolphin is ever replaced (Dolphin is the second, custom default skin we have used), 2) monobook is high-rez/wide-screen friendly, 3) I test my edits to make sure layouts are scalable, so low rez/phones can view them decently. What page would you like to analyze together? -- 16:47, 14 May 2014 (UTC)

Crazy Taxi Talk Page
Thanks, I didn't realize I had put in the Controls discussion. I actually went to the main game discussion page and wondered where it went! =) I went ahead and moved it to main game page. The old talk page is here if you'd like to delete it. TurboButtons (talk) 04:55, 20 May 2014 (UTC)

Purchasing Chrono Trigger
Hey NMH, didn't realize CT for Android was a thing. Would you like us to purchase it for you? We can either try to do that or just reimburse you for it. Let me know.  Pro cyon  04:10, 21 May 2014 (UTC)
 * @: I would really appreciate that! My goal at the moment is to get the Ocarina of Time images renamed and the Volgarr the Viking guide fleshed out (and I want to 100% the game). After that, or at the same time, I would be down to play CT on my tablet. Is there a gifting method through play store/gmail accounts? Or would you prefer to paypal me the $9.99? Btw, would you prefer to discuss this via email or Facebook? -- 05:24, 21 May 2014 (UTC)
 * Either email or FB is fine with me. Paypal probably makes the most sense.  And plus, as of last Monday, I work for them so I should probably encourage its use ;)  Pro  cyon  23:06, 21 May 2014 (UTC)

Dolphin skin
BTW, I left a comment on WhosAsking's page about the large Crystalis maps. I realize you and Paco prefer the older skins, but since the majority of our traffic views the site with the default dolphin skin, we should prioritize how the guides look in Dolphin. Ideally, we should make them look good in all skins whenever possible, but when we're forced to choose between one over the other, we should give preferential treatment to the default skin.  Pro cyon  23:06, 21 May 2014 (UTC)


 * @: congrats on the new job! Just for you, I've switched over to Dolphin. Ugh, I feel like this artificial constraint is really bad for game info. We want high-rez everything! Two ideas I have, which I won't get support for, would be to make Monobook the default skin, but make the main page a hardcoded page themed like Dolphin, so if anyone comes here they're like oh it's pretty, but when they go to a content page where space matters, there's nothing getting in their way. The other would be to revise dolphin so we aren't constrained to 60% of the screen. On my screens I have like 4 inches of total width in blue space (~700 pixels) wasted. I really dislike how we now have to go back through every guide we've ever created and optimize it to fit an artificially worse standard. -- 23:27, 21 May 2014 (UTC)


 * @: also, since there are no horizontal rules included under H2s, can we manually add them? Or is that CSS we can modify in Dolphin? I hate how Dolphin even changes the appearance of the content. -- 00:02, 22 May 2014 (UTC)


 * Hey NMH, I really appreciate your honesty about the skin. I actually share some of your concerns about the visible space, but there were a lot of technical and practical reasons for the choices that were made.  We went around and around about it, and I think you had an opportunity to weigh in on the beta site.  In the end, the pros (technical benefits, mobile compatibility) really outweighed the cons (guide width) and we pulled the trigger.  I'm not sure what you mean about horizontal rules, could you please clarify?  It is unfortunate that we have to verify multiple skins, but the alternative was to remove the ability to change them.  We can call a meeting about it (man, we haven't had one of those in a long time) if you feel strongly about it.   Pro  cyon  02:54, 22 May 2014 (UTC)


 * @: "Horizontal rule" is the full name for the HTML  tag. It appears that the dolphin CSS no longer shows a HR underneath the div accompanying H2 tags (or, in wikimarkup, ==This type of header== ). I think we should definitely re-implement it as the horizontal rule really offsets the section beneath it by drawing a visible line. Without it, it makes pages look like they go on forever in one continuous stream. The HR tag breaks up the whitespace very precisely. Also, the reason we do not use HR tags on pages is because the level 1 headers had that built in HR line, so we just told people to reserve the full-width black lines for level 1 headers and to not go crazy with drawing tons of lines across pages. -- 06:12, 22 May 2014 (UTC)


 * @: here's an issue. Take a look at Crystalis/Leaf. Some of the maps are full width. This looks great! However, on a mobile device, the width of the screen will force them to zoom in and out to see it, or click on the image. Is this an issue to you? If not, then great, we can make full-width images a commonly used visual. -- 23:45, 22 May 2014 (UTC)


 * @, : I went in and inspected the HTML/CSS for H2's on both Dolphin and Monobook. Monobook's H2 has this property that Dolphin's does not: "border-bottom: 1px solid #aaa;". Can we please add that to Dolphin? It really changes how pages look by visually separating them into blocks of grouped content. I often scan by looking at the lines themselves, not any of the words on the page. -- 00:29, 24 May 2014 (UTC)


 * @, : I made a change to MediaWiki:Dolphin.css so you can see the difference on pages now. Let me know if you approve. -- 23:40, 24 May 2014 (UTC)

Aigina no Yogen
Hey NMH, sorry to do this to you, but I already wrote a guide for Aigina no Yogen. Just didn't link it properly to the name of the game in the NES completion list. I apologize for that.  Pro cyon  01:41, 2 June 2014 (UTC)

P.S. We had to sort out a problem with Google Wallet, but we're through it now, so I should be able to reimburse you shortly.

TMNT arcade vs TMNT II guides
Hi NMH. I know you put a ton of effort into the TMNT II guide for the NES. I didn't realize that and a new user started working on the arcade guide. After realizing that you had already done the guide for the NES version, I figured I'd get in touch with you and see how strongly you felt for or against merging the content. To me, what it comes down to is the arcade version is the original, and the NES version is a port with two additional stages. Seems like a good case for combination, but if it seems like it would be more trouble than it's worth, I guess we can keep them separate. What are your thoughts?  Pro cyon  00:54, 3 June 2014 (UTC)


 * OK, I did a little research, and I found a case for the argument of leaving them separate. The arcade game as ported to several systems (Atari, Commodore, DOS, etc.), but the NES is the only port which contains the extra and extended levels, which makes it sort of a one-off.  So not only is that information invalid for the arcade version, it's also invalid for every other port based on the arcade version.  In my mind, that's enough justification to keep the NES version distinct from the original guide.  Let me know how you feel about it.   Pro  cyon  01:18, 3 June 2014 (UTC)
 * That sounds to me like the games are 80% the same, so we'd end up duplicating a lot of content. How different are the common portions, apart from naming? -- Prod (talk) 01:22, 3 June 2014 (UTC)
 * Of the content that is shared between both versions, there are fewer enemies present per section of each scene, but some stages were extended to have more sections than the arcade.  Pro cyon 


 * The reason I separated them to begin with is that I had thought that the maps and sprites were too different. The hitboxes and art, and the strategies tend to be all different. But, comparing this video (Arcade) to this one (NES), they are similar enough to combine guides like SMB2/SMA/Doki Doki. -- 01:50, 3 June 2014 (UTC)


 * Although I would love for each version of the game to have its own guide, because technical differences make for very specific timing or hit-box related strategies, we rarely ever get that technical. It would be better to combine and get the majority of readers to use our guide. -- 02:01, 3 June 2014 (UTC)


 * P.S. This is a good video source as well. Funny story, I'm FB friends with the guy who makes those, and he's a fan of SW.   Pro  cyon  02:13, 3 June 2014 (UTC)
 * Anyway, if we do combine them, I recommend the strategy that I mentioned on the talk page of the arcade guide: name the pages of the walkthrough after their environments, and simply map the stage numbers to the environment according to which version of the game you're talking about in the ToC or the Walkthrough. Then you don't deal with the headache of "this is Stage 5 on the NES, although it's really Stage 4" or "this is Stage 3 on the NES which is different from Stage 3 on the arcade," etc.   Pro  cyon  02:28, 3 June 2014 (UTC)
 * I did something similar for Gradius which has an extra stage only contained in the PC-Engine version if you want to take a look at an example.  Pro  cyon  02:30, 3 June 2014 (UTC)
 * I put a "NES exclusive" note for stage 4. The guides have been merged. -- 17:32, 3 June 2014 (UTC)
 * OK, I took a crack at organizing the ToC. Have a look at it, maybe you can come up with something less messy than I did, but honestly, that's the way the stages break down.  You can see part of the problem is that Scene 2 of the arcade encompasses all of Scene 2 of the NES, as well as the second half of Scene 3, but not the first.  Scene 3 of the arcade maps to scenes 4 and 5 of the NES.  It's not pretty.   Pro  cyon  00:13, 4 June 2014 (UTC)
 * Yeah, that's fine. Procyon. I made it look nicer. -- 00:35, 4 June 2014 (UTC)
 * This doesn't work with the AutoToC. I would suggest you put the levels as the first game names them, and then use the Walthrough page for the re-release as a lookup table so people can figure out where they should go. Maybe even on the main page. -- Prod (talk) 14:59, 4 June 2014 (UTC)
 * Crap, I completely forgot about the AutoToC. Prod, the levels don't really have names beyond the Scene labels that I listed in the table.  The names of the stages are merely descriptive titles to explain the environment.  I suppose we'll have to yank the table out of the ToC, put it in the Walkthrough, and then carefully label the links on the Footer Nav.  I'll try to clean all of this up.   Pro  cyon  16:26, 4 June 2014 (UTC)
 * Then I'd suggest sticking to the scene labels as the titles, since that's the most "official" description they have. Since the games do have a notable amount of difference, I'd suggest also splitting up the main page into two (like SM64 vs SM64DS). -- Prod (talk) 20:31, 4 June 2014 (UTC)


 * What is AutoToC? -- 20:41, 4 June 2014 (UTC)
 * @NMH: Ouch... if NMH doesn't know what the AutoToC is, I guess we didn't do a very good job highlighting it :( That's not your fault NMH, I'm glad that you asked the question because it means we may need to do more work to illustrate its function.  If you're on a guide page, you should notice three distinct "sections" below the search bar on the left.  The first is Navigation (which defaults to open).  The second is Tools (which should default to closed).  And the third is the AutoToC, which for guides, should be a collapsible hierarchical representation of that guide's Table of Contents.  It parses the ToC wiki (ignoring the columns) and generates links on the left so that you shouldn't have to rely on the actual Table of Contents navs to get around.  You should just be able to click the links on the left to find what you're looking for.  When not on a guide, it shows the major system Categories instead.  By adding the table to the TMNT(a) guide, I broke the AutoToC because it doesn't know how to parse the links out of the table, so I need to remove it.
 * @Prod: Here's the thing, outside of the graphics, there really isn't a notable amount of difference between the two versions. All there is, is the addition of two stages, one of which was injected in between two stages that are considered the same "scene" in the arcade.  This notion of "scenes" in the game is totally arbitrary.  In the end, they are still the same discrete stages, in the same exact order, and there just happens to be two additional stages present in the NES version.  Breaking the guides back up would a) undo all the hard work that NMH did, and b) still result in 8 out of 10 stages having nearly identical write-ups.  So I don't think that would solve the problem.   Pro  cyon  00:12, 5 June 2014 (UTC)
 * I mean to just split up the main pages, not the whole guide. Do title screens from both games say "Stage 1", or do they say completely different things? -- Prod (talk) 01:27, 5 June 2014 (UTC)
 * They agree on the names of the first two scenes. After that, it gets messy.  In the arcade, the third part of the second scene takes place after the newly introduced stage for the third scene of the NES game.  So the stages map together like this:

Arcade: 1--2--*-*--3--4-5 NES:   1--2--*--3--*--4--5--6--7
 * Note that the *s represent extra parts of the previously names scene. The arcade considers the street, the sewers, and the parking lot all of scene 2.  The NES game splits off the parking lot and puts it after an exclusive stage for scene 3.  Additionally, I don't think many users will be as familiar with the names of the scenes as they are with the basic environment descriptions.  I wouldn't know that "Let's get to that secret factory!" referred to the highway and skateboarding segments.   Pro  cyon  02:28, 5 June 2014 (UTC)


 * Ahhh yeah, I have noticed that left nav bar ToC copy. AutoToc, eh? I think I've used it twice. Not super useful, but good for new people who aren't familiar with how to view the table of contents by clicking the show button. Speaking of AutoToC, how do we edit it? The System Categories need the 8th gen consoles listed (PS4/Xbox One). Should we add Ouya to SW? -- 18:08, 5 June 2014 (UTC)


 * Back on topic - Proc/Prod: here's my solution:
 * Make sure every section of each page that identifies a new "stage" explains its presence in either version and also has an initial screenshot of that section to identify it (possibly from both versions if they look a little different). I think this should be mandatory no matter how we do the ToC, as it is just very helpful clarification-type information.
 * In the ToC, either split it up so we have duplicate links; e.g. 2 columns, one for Arcade listing and one for NES. That way AutoToC works and it replicates Proc's table. I will implement the ToC change now so you can see how it will look. -- 18:08, 5 June 2014 (UTC)