Talk:MapleStory

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Bot-catching monsters page?
Well, since there's getting to be so many of them now, and they aren't really normal monsters, anyone else think it might be a good idea to put these on a separate page like Event or boss monsters? This was brought up to me by users of the wiki so I was wondering if this seemed like a good change. --IsaacGS 21:30, 10 February 2008 (CST)


 * Just put them in MapleStory/Bot-catching monsters. -- 23:52, 10 February 2008 (CST)
 * I think the proper one would be MapleStory/Monsters/Bot-Catching or something. I just want to know if it sounds like something worth doing, and if it were to be done would we leave them in the regular level range.--IsaacGS 00:28, 11 February 2008 (CST)
 * If there's like 10+ monsters I think they should have their own category (by category I mean page). -- 02:52, 11 February 2008 (CST)
 * Category? I agree with giving them their own page.  But I'd suggest making it more like the pets page rather than a monsters page, since most of the stats about them aren't relevant. Wait, can they actually be killed?  Could you perhaps put up an explanation of how they work as well? -- Prod (Talk) 21:48, 12 February 2008 (CST)
 * Will do.--IsaacGS 01:52, 13 February 2008 (CST)

Nothing is Exlusive
Just delet it, I knew that Coke Town coming to JMS but nevermind. For example, if some of the verisions choise to add Shalom Temple for the jewish people in their country? so we all don't know. Premium Road Expansion are Exlusive? who said that?! --217.132.5.80

ThailandMS doesn't have Amoria PQ or Monster Carnival yet.
I think the website says they will come out in patch v.47? Right now they only got Mu Lung and Herb Town in patch v.44. I checked the data, no Amoria PQ strings and no Monster Carnival strings yet. -- Takiten 23:04, 26 February 2008 (CST)
 * Hm.. PiPU said that it would probably become available later in to patch .46. If it's not in the data though then I don't see how that's possible.--IsaacGS 00:04, 27 February 2008 (CST)
 * ThaiMS patched to v0.47 today. (69MB patch file). The updates contained Mu Lung, Herb Town, Monster Carnival and Amoria Dungeon (All 5 maps likes GlobalMS, Liplock Keys was dropped now, but Amos didn't allow players go into PQ.) Amoria PQ will be released in this version 2~3 weeks later. -- PiPU 08:10, 27 February 2008 (CST)
 * 5 monster maps? Or is it just Purple Plains 1/2, Purplewood Forest 1/2, and Amos' Training Ground (which has no monsters)?--IsaacGS 14:01, 27 February 2008 (CST)
 * Yes, 4 Monster maps and Amos' Training Ground. -- PiPU 07:59, 28 February 2008 (CST)

HKMS 0.05
Did HKMS release the Pine forest in 0.05? The patch list says so but the monster page did not. I need someone to confirm this. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Fideltan (talk • contribs).
 * Yeah, they did release it. Monster page needs to be updated.--IsaacGS 01:15, 28 February 2008 (CST)

Taiwan New Leaf City
I found something interesting:

-When you buy ticket and and talk with the NPC, he takes you to New Leaf City, without the train!

-The pots price in TaiwanMS are high, 18k for Ginger Ale Oo.

-New Leaf City got slightly altered there.


 * TaiwanMS doesn't have Henesys Party Quest.

TigerMan 13:24, 28 February 2008 (CST)

Haunted House towns page
Alright, this needs a little more in-depth explanation. Since every version that released the town had a different way to get there, they had different NPCs available in the town map. KMS had a completely separate and new set of NPCs in the town. Things that show up in CMS/GMS/EMS town as just map objects are NPCs in KMS. The opposite is also true to an extent. In CMS/EMS/TMS, they didn't have NLC at the time so they had a potion NPC added. One can go on listing a dozen more similar differences, but the fact of the matter is that this isn't unusual. EVERY town has different NPCs in it. In Henesys in GMS, we have Thomas Swift and the Mad Bunny and Nana and Cody. Those aren't there in MSEA or EMS or any other version. The differences in Amoria are even greater than that. It won't stop, either; it'll probably keep getting more and more different each year as time goes on. So, it's just not worth it to list all the various minor differences. Haunted House is just one of many areas like this, so simply stating "the town's residents vary between versions." will be sufficient.--IsaacGS 16:22, 28 February 2008 (CST)

Yeah, that the reason why i edit that.

And there is 3 verisions on this town:

-KoreaMS: SO diffrents from the others, include PQ and diffrent MONSTERS, NPC's and QUESTS, the name of the mini map: "Entrace to Haunted Mansion" so the name diffrent, you go there by ITEM.

-EuropeMS, TaiwanMS and ChinaMS: This verision has DIFFRENT QUESTS, you go there in ChinaMS and Taiwan from Edmunds the Butler, in EuropeMS by Charles, the Potoin Seller ONLY for quest (it sell some pot that you need for quest), the town is Hidden-Street.

GlobalMS: For Masteria, why do you say ONLY for Masrtera?!? why did you put: "Agent Falcon has yet another quest which is now permanently available" this is not like that in other verisions, let me edit it for th whole EVENT TOWN.

So what do you say? I have chacked this town in EVRY verision :]

TigerMan 04:23, 29 February 2008 (CST)
 * Yes, but since anyone who is visiting that town today MUST be visiting it in GlobalMS, then the only thing that's relevant is information on GlobalMS's (original) version of it. It doesn't matter that the NPCs in CMS/EMS/TMS Haunted House don't do anything now, because there's no way that anyone can see them now. All the really important differences are already listed. It's not necessary or wise to go through every stupid minute detail because it's pointless.--IsaacGS 13:52, 29 February 2008 (CST)

It is suposte to be information from whole verisions doesn't it? And you give information from whole verisions and not everyone who visiting here play GlobalMS, alof of people from Europe, Singapore, Malasya and other countries visiting here. In addition, nexon said they are going to open evry verisions for all the world (Austraila, South America, Turkey, India and MAYBE Indonesia), also 50% from the people who visiting here not from North America (like me?). TigerMan 16:17, 29 February 2008 (CST)
 * I'm not saying that everyone who visits Strategywiki is playing Global. I said everyone who is visiting the Haunted House is in Global, because it's not available in any other versions right now. You aren't understanding what I'm saying. Differences in maps and town structure, that is important. The presence/absence of basic NPCs such as Potion shops is important. Whether some Event NPC is there and how each version has a different event NPC is not important. We don't need to list every single NPC.--IsaacGS 16:47, 29 February 2008 (CST)

Ok you right, but I think we need to creat KMS Hounted Mansion, because it is have VERY diffrent thing, diffrent monsters, NPC's, map names, look VERY DIFFRENT. And I think we should add the MAIN NPC's for each town (not every NPC, just the main, like toys NPC's in Ludibrium) to the towns pages, what do you think? TigerMan 17:01, 29 February 2008 (CST)
 * I tried that at one time, it didn't work out very well. Maybe just one representative NPC from each town to show what the people there are like. I've been thinking about creating a separate "Event" version of the mansion page but i don't think that would work that well.--IsaacGS 17:13, 29 February 2008 (CST)

Haunted House event verision will not work well? I have NPC's, screenshots, monsters, quests and more! And that what I said, like the TOYS ONLY NPC's in Ludibrium, not like Cody, Hera and all of those. TigerMan 04:56, 1 March 2008 (CST)

Oh and should we delete everything that every verison has? TigerMan 05:18, 1 March 2008 (CST)

CMS
After I checked:

-It has Maple Island Expansion.

-It has Trade Auto Window Pop Up System.

-It has Henesys Party Qust.

-It has the TaiwanMS Gachapon.

-It doesn't has Report System.

-It has FULL Automatic Quest Helper.

-It has Kerning City Expansion. (HK has Partial)

-You cannot go to Shanghai Wai-Tan from Spinel the World Tour NPC.

-It has Party Leader System.


 * MapleSEA and GlobalMS have only partial of Level 200 Skills.

TigerMan 07:04, 29 February 2008 (CST)

Premium Road - Ludibrium & El Nath
I added that now.

I don't know which version has it, except that ThailandMS and JapanMS has it and MapleSEA doesn't, now i will check in ChinaMS but I cant check in KoreaMS. TigerMan 06:19, 1 March 2008 (CST)

Help(?)
I don't know if those verisions got those UI:

Joypad Setting - KoreaMS: ???.

Upgraded Character Info: KoreaMS: ???, JapanMS: ???, ThailandMS: ???.

Gift System: KoreaMS: ???, JapanMS: ???, ThailandMS: ???.

TigerMan 09:15, 2 March 2008 (CST)
 * What is "upgraded character info"? Gift system isn't important...--IsaacGS 14:34, 2 March 2008 (CST)

Upgraded Character Info: http://img152.imageshack.us/img152/6736/characterinfoey6.png

And why doesn't Gift System importam? doesn't every verision has it.

TigerMan 16:01, 2 March 2008 (CST)
 * Because it doesn't affect gameplay at all.--IsaacGS 16:38, 2 March 2008 (CST)

It is still UI Game, it is like I will say: "Trade Auto Pop Up System doesn't affect at the game", every UI can come in every patch.

TigerMan 10:52, 3 March 2008 (CST)
 * Not really... trading is something that every player does all the time. Gifting rarely happens. It just isn't important.--IsaacGS 13:44, 3 March 2008 (CST)

Ok, do you have KoreaMS/JapanMS/ThilandMS to check those things? TigerMan 03:40, 4 March 2008 (CST)
 * PiPU will come and clarify the other things about ThaiMS eventually. I'm positive that the "upgraded character info" is not in KMS, pretty sure it isn't in JMS. I'm not sure whether KMS has the joypad settings, i'll have to check.--IsaacGS 13:19, 4 March 2008 (CST)

Ok, but what is this Storage Locking System? TigerMan 06:34, 5 March 2008 (CST)
 * It asks you for a special password before you can access the storage NPC...--IsaacGS 10:57, 5 March 2008 (CST)

Joypad Setting - KoreaMS: ???.

Upgraded Character Info: KoreaMS: ???, ThailandMS: ??? (I think they don't have).

Report System: JapanMS (Manual/No): ???, Thailand (Manual/No): ???.

Premium Road - Ludibrium & El Nath: KoreaMS: ???, ChinaMS: ???.

TigerMan 04:59, 7 March 2008 (CST)
 * Joypad Setting - KoreaMS: No << Last time that I've played KMS, They don't have it.
 * Upgraded Character Info: KoreaMS: No, ThailandMS: No (I think they don't have). << Don't have both.
 * Report System: JapanMS (Manual/No): No, Thailand (Manual/No): No. << JMS and ThaiMS using web report.
 * Premium Road - Ludibrium & El Nath: KoreaMS: Yes, ChinaMS: Not Sure. << KMS have it since v1.2.1, don't know about CMS -- PiPU 23:57, 7 March 2008 (CST)

New Leafre Boss and Monster by Version
did kmst release a leafre boss (green/leaf mushroom type monster)? I did saw it at SEA MS forum but it was not shown in the monster page. can anyone confirm this?

also, could we make a list of Monsters by Version of the game? I was looking through the lists and reading them. There is very few ways to tell which monsters are in which version. So we could add next to the elemental lists a list by versions of the game. --Fideltan 13:47, 18 March 2008 (CDT)
 * No, that's an edit. It looks very fake, I don't see how so many people are getting fooled by it. As to the suggestion of Monsters by version, that would be a LOT of work for very little benefit. You can basically tell what monsters are out by the area availability chart. The onyl monsters this doesn't help with are the Area Bosses, and Area Boss availability is listed on the Other chart. However, listing monsters based on what towns they appear in might be worthwhile.--IsaacGS 13:59, 19 March 2008 (CDT)
 * On the actual monster pages, can't you just add a "version" bullet in one of the boxes? No need for an extra page, but at least provide such data...  -- 19:43, 19 March 2008 (CDT)
 * The best way I can think of to do it would be to place on each Towns page a list of the monsters that can be found there. That way to see if a certain monster were in a specific version, you would just need to know which town it was in (which is mentioned in every single monster's description to the best of my knowledge) and then if that town is available. Besides, a good 75% of all monsters are found in every version, and the remainder are either only located in 1 version at the moment, or will be released in the near future.--IsaacGS 15:21, 20 March 2008 (CDT)

Nautilus Dock
Should we change Port to Dock now that we know the official english name? (MSEA data) -- Takiten 15:17, 8 April 2008 (CDT)
 * eh, let's leave it a while longer, they messed up some other translations that were already correct in GMS (such as "Happy Valley" for Wandering Bear Area's road name) and a few other things so we'll see.--IsaacGS 16:15, 8 April 2008 (CDT)

CMS Pine Forest
Did CMS get Black Crow/Dreamy Ghosts? -- Takiten 21:50, 8 April 2008 (CDT)
 * Not from what I've heard. They have Water Goblins in the 3rd map instead, like KMS. Nothing wrong with their Showa apparently, though.--IsaacGS 22:52, 8 April 2008 (CDT)

HKMS v0.08 - Need a better translation
Well, I used Google Translate to translate the patch. And here's the patch information:

http://strategywiki.org/w/index.php?title=MapleStory/Patches/MapleHK&oldid=263673

It's pretty hard to understand what it says.

I'm pretty sure that they got Mu Lung and Herb Town, Monster Identifier, Auto Item Rearrangement, Skill Macro and Bullet Taxi. But I'm not sure about everything else. Does anyone have a better translation? DiamondSW 00:24, 24 April 2008 (CDT)

Training locations formatting
The mismatching formatting of the guide looks bad (it varies a lot on each page). Thus I want to do a massive edit spree making all of the training locations have a similar aesthetic on all the class pages. Is there any particular look for this that you guys think looks and works the best? It seems like a good idea to ask for input first since a lot of people are pretty active working on this guide. Here are the main points I have found to come up within the section: If we can agree on something I will happily run around and put it into effect. As always, Zai is here for formatting busy work nobody wants to do. --Zaiqukaj 06:54, 27 April 2008 (CDT)
 * Main points of the section
 * level range
 * Time estimation/level
 * Suggested locations
 * Suggested monsters to focus on
 * Strategies for locations and/or fighting monsters
 * I think it should stick to a regular paragraph of info except for a header to state the level ranges. As long as it's clear which section you should read at your current level, it should be good enough. -- Prod (Talk) 10:56, 27 April 2008 (CDT)
 * It's kinda hard to make a generic guide since the available training spots vary between versions. I'm not very good with this kind of info, so you're welcome to change it as you see fit. --IsaacGS 18:42, 27 April 2008 (CDT)
 * Cool, then I'm going to do some research while proofreading things. For some reason proofreading is easyer with an objective. --Zaiqukaj 03:07, 28 April 2008 (CDT)

Adding Monsters into Town Page
I think it's a great idea, for easier convenient and makes it easier to know which monsters are at where... Thanks!--Peace4ever
 * While it might be useful, the way that it was done on the Singapore page didn't look very good. I'm thinking we should put it on a sub page or something just to keep the towns page clean.--IsaacGS 01:08, 9 May 2008 (CDT)
 * I think just adding lists of enemies without images would be better. Keeps the pages clean without requiring additions of more new pages. -- Prod (Talk) 20:54, 10 May 2008 (CDT)
 * Ok, I decided to try out the list of names on the Omega Sector page. Suggestions?--IsaacGS 14:05, 16 May 2008 (CDT)
 * Cool, I like it!--Peace4ever
 * So I have done all of Victoria, Ossyria, Masteria and Elin Forest. The only things left are event towns (should be easy enough.) and World tour areas. Not quite sure how the World Tour pages should go since they're oddly divided compared to the rest of the pages. That's all I plan on doing for now, if someone else would like to work on it I have a list of the monsters in most of the world tour areas on a subpage of my user page, but it's not split up according to what section of the town it's in.--IsaacGS 14:53, 20 May 2008 (CDT)

VietnamMS
added to the charts. In any case where I was unsure of a feature's release, I marked it as "No". If you know this feature is present, then change it.--IsaacGS 23:49, 21 June 2008 (CDT)

Cash Shop Auction System
This is a new system that you need to got to the cash shop and you can bid for items. I don't know any other info of this. JMS, TWMS and GMS has it. Not sure about the rest, but I know it's not in MSEA, EMS, BMS, VMS. It is not MTS Trading System. I don't understand why it is list under there. It is a different system from MTS. OPSSSS 00:36, 24 June 2008 (CDT)
 * What on earth are you talking about? There's nothing like that in GMS.--IsaacGS 02:46, 24 June 2008 (CDT)

Patches List
I tried to make KoreaMS to KMS JapanMS to JMS...etc. It worked perfect and i removed all those like Partial, Test Server Only, Part 1 only, Exclusive. Hope you don't mind cos more versions of maplestory is coming and now it looks so squeezy, i make it like that. for the PartiAL, eXCLUSIVE THING, It is too long and test server and partial will eventually realease in the main server o release the whole thing, exclusive? eventually become avaiable to all version in some time, Part 1 only will eventually release all partsOPSSSS 00:09, 25 June 2008 (CDT)
 * It does not look good. It looks horrible. Stop making huge changes without consulting the other editors. --IsaacGS 00:33, 25 June 2008 (CDT)

Knights of Cygnus
I want to start adding some info on them, but I'm not quite sure how to go about it. Yes, Cygnus classes match up to the main jobs (That is, there's Cygnus Archer, Cygnus Magician, etc.) however they're radically different from the standard classes and share a lot more in common with each other than their base classes, for example job advancements, training quests, skills like the Sprite, and so on. However I wouldn't want to make 5 new pages, either. Maybe just a general Cygnus page, then separate skill build and training areas for each of the classes? They use the regular class equipment btw, so there's no need to duplicate that (except for starter gear).--IsaacGS 19:20, 6 January 2009 (UTC)

Removal of World Tour in KoreaMS.
I believe official KoreaMS just removed the world tour. All 4 world tour towns they had are now no longer accessible. The also moved the world tour bosses to various places in Victora and Ossyria since they were no longer accessible in their original maps. I assume all this info will be added eventually. From what I've gathered from various maplestory forums: Blue Mushmom is in Korean Folk Town now, and Snack Bar is in Kerning City. No idea where Giant Centipede is yet or if the Python counted as a monster that needed to be relocated to victoria/ossyria or not.

I believe the reason KMS is removing those maps, is because of how unpopular they were. Those world tour maps are hardly ever used in JMS, so I imagine it was the same in KMS. Getting rid of those maps just means the overall install file of the game will be slightly smaller. That could be the reason why they are removing them. Or it's possible they plan on using the new "World Tour Agency" map to maybe open and close the world tour at certain times of the year, for event reasons, or maybe even charge people NXcash to visit the world tours in the future? I guess we'll just have to wait and see. -- Takiten 20:57, 18 January 2009 (UTC)


 * The Centipede is in Herb Town, if you check the Monsters page I added the new versions of those bosses (they're all slightly weakened). I don't think this change is in Official KMS yet (From what I've seen it will be removed this week though.) As for data size, it looks like the maps and all the necessary info is still there so it wouldn't really be smaller. About the World Tour Agency area, no idea what the deal is with it. I plan on leaving my infighter in Formosa before the patch to see it.--IsaacGS 21:55, 18 January 2009 (UTC)

Skill Build Informaton
With one of the most recent patches, (at least in GMS) the following information to stat builds has been rendered invalid:


 * One must put the points into the stats for your job
 * One must roll for stats
 * One has to distribute stats themselves
 * One must have the required stats for job choice

All of these are no longer true. If you want to be a mage, as a beginner, you don't have to be weak because you dumped all your points into int and luck. You can now build yourself pure str for the first 8 levels, then get it all reset when you speak with Grendel. Same for the other 4 jobs. No longer do you have to roll for stats, you are automatically given 4s in the stats that don't effect you. Also, the auto stat distribution works for all those who are doing normal (that is, non dex-less low luck etc) builds.

We should update the pages with the new info. Gratzi. Lego6245 18:36, 15 May 2009 (UTC)


 * No need to announce changes, just make them. It already looks like you've written an adequate submission. -- 01:09, 20 May 2009 (UTC)

I have sorted the Job quests section into different parts. Will it make the quests easier to follow, or the level range system works better. FlyXwing 13:08, 26 June 2009 (UTC)

Change to KoC Guide
The KoC Guide page is locked and there is some false information on it. Namely the fact that EuropeMS will follow the old system in which you have to go to Erev on the character you wish to be the parent and make the character this way. Although this is the information that was given in the ingame "Pop Quiz", it is infact incorrect. EuropeMS will follow the new system where at the Character Creation screen, you choose either Cygnus or Adventurer.

If you'd like some proof of that:

Tempus 13:39, 1 August 2009 (UTC)


 * The page is only locked to anonymous and newly registered users. EMS users will change the page when the information is verifiable in-game on non-test servers. It's not worth anyone's time to debate unreleased content. On a side note, I'm curious to see the bio they wrote for the Cygnus Knights; could you take another screenshot while selecting those characters? Thanks, -- 06:09, 2 August 2009 (UTC)

Here's the extracted biography image for KoC:

http://amandamlees.com/reqs/UI/Login.img/RaceSelect.knight.text.0.png

Also, how long does it take before newly registered users can edit the page? I've got the images / skill effects for the missing 2nd and 3rd Cygnus skills that I'd like to put in.

Tempus 11:21, 3 August 2009 (UTC)


 * I'm not sure what the qualifications are, because they are hidden inside the code and I don't have access, but typically it's based on time (i.e. 1 week after registering) or minimum number of edits (i.e. a minimum 50 edits). Thanks for the bio, -- 18:06, 3 August 2009 (UTC)

Town checklist
This is a checklist to make sure the following town-specific content is illustrated on each town page. "Unverified" refers to item listings that exist but have not been double checked or updated with links. "Partial" refers to listings that have been started but are incomplete. In most cases, towns are missing grocer items.

StrategWiki user specialization
The following is a list of the SW users who play MapleStory, and what versions of the game they play. Feel free to add, remove, or update this list.

-- 02:47, 21 October 2009 (UTC)

Special template for Theme Dungeons
I just had an idea. Since the Korean test server released two new theme dungeons, and one in the official server, isn't it better to add a special template just for Theme Dungeons?

Maybe they will create more than three Theme Dungeons. I suggest adding a template in Areas and move Theme Dungeons above World Tour Areas.

What do you think?--Spadow 19:47, 28 October 2009 (UTC)


 * Actually it depends. If the Theme Dungeons are going to be implemented to other versions of the game it should be added to the template. If it is a substitute of world tour areas which will be in Korean game client only, then I do not get the point. I would wait and see what the future will show us. Vigilium 20:35, 28 October 2009 (UTC)


 * Without more information about what a "theme dungeon" is, it's hard to make a decision. Neo City looks exactly like Neo Tokyo, so why would we add a new section? -- 22:34, 28 October 2009 (UTC)


 * Neo City looks exactly like Neo Tokyo, but with different NPC/Mob positions and changes. In total, there are three theme dungeons. Theme Dungeons might be Korea exclusive, but I don't know.--Spadow 02:23, 29 October 2009 (UTC)


 * As far as the Neo Tokyo changes made for Neo City, those can be documented on the MapleStory/Towns/Japan page. For theme dungeons, we should treat them as mini-dungeons (KPQ Theme dungeon should appear under Victoria Island). Are theme dungeons PQs? -- 19:42, 29 October 2009 (UTC)


 * Theme Dungeons are not PQs. They're new areas, in Mushroom Castle there is a sort of Party Quest available. Neo City has nothing to do with Japan (except that Neo Tokyo was designed by the Japanese Nexon team). So actually, Neo City does not belong on the MapleStory/Towns/Japan page.--Spadow 23:05, 30 October 2009 (UTC)


 * First of all, Neo City = Neo Tokyo. Therefore, Neo City information resides under the Neo Tokyo section on the Japan page. Secondly, the new areas should be listed under the most logical section (Mushroom Castle under Victoria Island). Unless GMS uses a blanket term like "Theme Dungeon", I don't think it is necessary to categorize these additions as a separate concept (they are just additional maps on an already categorized and familiar continent). -- 00:56, 31 October 2009 (UTC)


 * Well, wouldn't be to bad of an idea in my thinking, considering that there are Mushroom Castle files in MSEA. As for Neo City, it is almost completly equal to Neo Tokyo, except a couple of the files are different. Kerning Square seems to somewhat resemble a world tour area too, Taipei 101. I don't know if MSEA or even further, possibly GMS will be getting Kerning Square at all, but in my opinion, for now, it wouldn't be such a bad idea. --Trickyb 22:18, 5 December 2009 (UTC)


 * MSEA is patching to ver. 0.88 tomorrow. Kerning Square is translated and Neo City is also found in the data but untranslated. So, yes, other versions will be get these dungeons. So how about my suggestion now?--Spadow 11:26, 8 February 2010 (UTC)


 * And as you're already aware I'm sure, GMS is patching to ver. 0.83 tomorrow and with it come Neo City and Kerning Square. So a special template for Theme Dungeons would be quite ideal at this point. Imjon 09:25, 18 February 2010 (UTC)